Club Penguin Fanon Wiki:Traffic Concern

IRC Log

 * <+Peril> I still... don't seem to understand the core purpose of this wiki...
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> ............................................... BOOOM
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: what do you find confusing maybe I can help :3
 *  same here.
 * <+Peril> What am I s'possed to do? Just... shovel out characters and stories?
 *  Hmm.
 *  OK.
 *  Here's what.
 *  Peril, you are an Author.
 *  you make characters,
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: its fanfiction man
 * <+Peril> How?
 *  preferrably from your imagination,
 *  and make stories.
 *  it's a process.
 *  FIRST.
 * <+ZONEsama> fanfiction based on CP is its core
 * <+Peril> How do I make them? e_e
 *  You need a Character User.
 *  You make a page.
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: you think whatever comes to your mind
 *  Zone, i think this guy need to have Wikitext 101
 * <+ZONEsama> think of a character, we'll say penguin for basic template
 * <+Peril> No, I mean how do I make a page for that character? I don't seem to be able to create a page....
 *  Peril, I'm going to start your page for you.
 * <+ZONEsama> ahh, that's easy
 *  I'll show you in a second.
 *  i can make one for you.
 * <+ZONEsama> Swiss_Ninja: no
 * <Swiss_Ninja> if you want.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> ok.
 * <+Peril> I've got ideas, countless ones, but I don't seem to be able to... find out.. how to apply them. >:/
 * <+ZONEsama> teach a man to fish and he eats forever
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: go to main page
 * <Swiss_Ninja> ok.
 * <+ZONEsama> scroll down
 * <+Peril> Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Old saying, XD
 * <+ZONEsama> there is a box that says "create a page"
 * <+Peril> Okay.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> It should say: "Create a page"
 * <+Peril> Yes?
 * <Swiss_Ninja> you can type it in right there.
 * <+ZONEsama> you type the name of your character or title or whatever
 * <+ZONEsama> and then you click on create page
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Yeah.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Preferrably, you should make your Character user first.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> which would be called "Vandal."
 * <+Peril> How do I make it appear in the character box thingy? The one with the whole list?
 * <+Peril> Wait, I have to make on for myself? e_e
 * <Swiss_Ninja> It's called an Infobox.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> No.
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> Well, if you see, my first character was "Mister Fisk"
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> Originally Mr. Fisk, but TS insists on putting the full name :/
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> like with my first country
 * <Swiss_Ninja> http://fanon.clubpenguinwiki.info/wiki/Template:CharacterInfobox/doc
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Here.
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> He made it be in the ENGLISH name, when I liked it in its French Name
 * <Swiss_Ninja> it's the link to the code you need to copy and paste to make the infobox for a character.
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: go to http://fanon.clubpenguinwiki.info/wiki/Template:CharacterInfobox
 * <+ZONEsama> copy/paste the code
 * <+ZONEsama> fill out the form by typing everything next to the = signs
 * <+ZONEsama> preview to see if the changes suit you
 * <Swiss_Ninja> :)
 * <Swiss_Ninja> oh,
 * <Swiss_Ninja> and Peril,
 * <+ZONEsama> so like name      = peril
 * <+ZONEsama> or something like that
 * <Swiss_Ninja> you should also give your character a last name to give it a distiction as well.
 * <+Peril> Okay. LEt me give it a shot....
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: need any help just ask, it is my job on CPWN to help after all :3
 * <+Peril> Sure thing.
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> I doubt Peril will ever be really active like Swissy.
 * <+ZONEsama> feel free to ask other users as well, many of them can give you some really good insight
 * <+ZONEsama> make fanfic, make friends, make fun :P
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Yeah.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> and I'm pretty active.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> so i'm also available too...
 * <+Peril> What are the "factions?"
 * <+Peril> Is there a war or something? e_e
 * <+Peril> Health? Level? Is this... a... video game?
 * <+Flyboy7> Hi Swiss_Ninja
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Hi Flywish.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> oh yeah.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> Factions...it's basically facts of the character.
 * <Swiss_Ninja> like his occupation..
 * <+Peril> That... that's not what a faction is...
 * <+Peril> Um... never mind...
 * <+FiskertonPhantom> Faction is like The Empire or The Rebels
 * <+Peril> I know what a faction is.
 * <+ZONEsama> Peril: faction is completely optional
 * <+Peril> But... are there factions... on the wiki? I think thats... cool and all but... how are new users supposed to know all this...
 * <+ZONEsama> mmmyes now that you mention it it is pretty confusing
 * <+Peril> Isn't there, like, a tutorial page or something explaining all this? It'd help a lot with new users...
 * <+ZONEsama> hmmm actually that's not a bad idea
 * <+ZONEsama> I will get to work on one within the week
 * <+ZONEsama> but for factions, some characters have armies
 * <+ZONEsama> you could align yourself to someone's army like
 * <+Peril> I, um... I don't think I'm cut out for wikias. I'll just stick to other things, I guess...
 * <+ZONEsama> hmmmm
 * <+ZONEsama> this might be the reason why CPFW doesn't get much traffic

Discussion
I think we may of found why CPFW doesn't get much traffic, its not because of google juice or anything like that but its because new users find this site confusing. Starting to see why the poor guy found the site confusing; you can't really expect a new user to instantly know everything about the site when he first comes here, ergo I suggest a very highly detailed help page. Sure, you have the basic help pages but I don't think that's enough. I think we should really buckle down and get a fluid, detailed help page going on; anyone agree? Zone 03:32, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

Agreed. I tried to do a help page once, but that's long outdated. A video perhaps?--Sir Kwiksilver of TARDIS- What kind of hallway is this? Is this your house?   04:15, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

A video you say? I can make one for you! I can animate characters if you want. Talk to me on my Skype about this.--FOR CLUB PENGUIN, TRANSFORMERS, LEGO, TRAINS, YUUSHA, AND GUNDAM! 04:59, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Making a video takes way more time and effort than a guide, no need to make this harder than it needs to be man lOl.
 * Also thank-you Railfan for removing my comment >_> Zone 04:58, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

I agree with this. It shouldn't be that hard to make an informative, and easy to understand help page. I'd be happy to help with this if I can, but I don't have Skype so I can't participate in any Skype calls (I might get it soon however).
 * I'm not really sure what route we're going to take, personally I'd prefer it if we made an article because I doubt anyone has the time/patience to make a video that goes into detail about wikicode, how to make a character article etc. Remember, we gotta also take in simple things to consideration such as how to create a page, because although we might know simple wiki functions a majority of new users don't. I'm sure we all remember our first time on wikis and how hard it was for us to adjust, and once this generation of users gets bored and don't feel like editing here anymore we gotta try help the next generation so that CPFW can live on forever :3 Zone 11:20, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

I understand. It was hard for me the first time I edited, so I can understand how it could be hard for other new users.

Add a template inserter to the create page, make templates easier to use, etc.

I was thinking an optional, opt-out, non-sucky RTE, like FCKEditor. -- refractor  welcome to I N C E P T I O N 12:49, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
 * What about CKEditor?--XTUX345: "May the Bird of Paradise fly up your nose! May an elephant caress you with his toes!" 14:45, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

I'm actually quite interested in this but if it begins to invovle the whole "political" debate (which somehow it will, mark my words) then I'm out.

Anyway, it's sort of hard to just jump in and randomly start editing. When I returned, I found it very hard to understand despite the fact that I'd followed the wiki for so long and already knew all the basis articles and many others. This "guide" should include (and feel free to add more, as more suggestions means a better guide!):


 * An introduction to the wiki (what it's about, what you do here, what it's not)
 * How to edit/make a good article (there should be a link to the "How to make an orignial character" guide, I actuallly found that pretty useful myself =P).
 * Rules. (Of course, we'd have to establish the rules first!)
 * Users, talk pages, social profiles (userpages) signatures, that type of thing.
 * Popular articles/important articles/"articles you should know".
 * Editcount/promotions. (maybe, although I don't think it's completely nessecary)
 * OOC, ownership and lack thereof.
 * Cool stuff/community features (maybe).

Once again, we need to establish the rules. But, we can't really do it because it's such a busy time of year. TS is inactive due to schooling, many users are off due to exams (including myself), and for various other reasons. For now let's just make the guide have a link to the old laws.

Concerning discussions: We have talk pages, we have forums, we have IRC. Frankly, Skype is awful. It crashed my laptop, therefore I cannot go on it anymore. Not all people can use Skype. IRC usually turns into arguments instead of civilised debates, and people lose connections (especially when you're out in the middle of nowhere like me with a satellite connection). I say we either revive the forums or do it old-style and use the actual discussion page.

--<font face="Gabriola" color ="green"> Triskelle3 <span title="Yous should click here - it's class, like.">Talk to me! 13:48, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Adding on to what you suggested, I would also suggest terminology (defining what OC's, parodies, collabs, mary sues etc are), basic wiki functions (how to create an article, where to use bold and italics in articles), IRC (general commands and how to connect), article deletion/adoption, quality templates, import and generally anything really. We need to try be as detailed as possible. Also, I came across this upon my daily trips around the wiki; it looks great so far but I think we could expand on it a whole lot more.


 * As for the rules, yes I think we all know its a touchy subject (lOl) but if you want to simplify the rules then we use common sense. If you get banned for something you did on Club Penguin, you'd most likely get banned for the same thing here, right? Some food for thought, also I removed that "Triskelle3's thoughts" heading because no need to draw attention to your opinion; people will read it nonetheless :3 Zone 14:23, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

I think having a WYSIWYG editor by default (for new users) would help make them more productive. That way they could edit easily and n00bs could get the hang of using the wiki easily. Although documentation is good, a WYSIWYG editor would let new users start editing right away. Perhaps we should also make it easier (or more obvious) to make new pages, as some newbies might not understand the process.--XTUX345: "May the Bird of Paradise fly up your nose! May an elephant caress you with his toes!" 14:42, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

Some older users might remember a forum post of mine being deleted by the old dictatorial regime in the old wiki because it suggested new ideas. Unfortunately, I can't find it anymore, but it dwelled on the core purpose of the wiki and why it is not appealing at all.

I seriously cannot make any sense out of it. The first thing to do about this wiki is to reorganise the main page. Smack bang - as soon as you load the website for the first time - you have a general gist of what this fictional universe is. Use images, icons, whatever.

All you guys need to do is to make that main page useful. It's used for announcements and all that (which is how the CP Wiki's main page looked like). I understand this is a very socialised community, and there's nothing wrong with that on a fanon site. But for the main page, you could instead use that valuable space to open up a gateway to a immersive universe where there are characters, countries and interesting and funny stories. Use portals, for example, where there is a "hub" page for a certain aspect of the wiki - like Countries or Characters or Races.

Here's an example of a great portal page: http://ratchet.wikia.com/wiki/Portal:Astronomy (this used to look so much more nicer before the new Wikia, but it's informative nonetheless).

Use high-traffic pages such as the main page itself to let users have a grasp on how this wiki works, instead of confusing them with user announcements and trivial featurettes of some emperor penguin who ate some salmon.

Then you need to start structuring things. Structuring is the key word here. The universe lacks strucutre, and it's very difficult to traverse your way through a certain culture in the world. There are so many stories that do not work well together as they conflict in history, background and events. I still do not have any idea what the "Antarctica" of this world is composed of.

Have a great-looking map. In fact, use what we call an image map. It's basically an image that can link you to many other articles by clicking on a certain part of the image. It's very useful when making maps, and some of the CPW may have seen it used on the world map. If you can make a professional-looking world map and then have an image map on top of it, with maybe a portal for each country and etc then you could make navigation a lot easier.

Also, prioritise the big stuff. There are so many minor characters being featured on the main page. Instead, you should be featuring the important things of the world permanently, and then having featurettes on either a community page for the users or a section of the main page that only existing users would look to naturally.

Those are my tips for now. -- <font face="Tahoma">Tigernose    <font face="Aharoni">Talk  •  <font face="Aharoni">Contribs  19:23, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

I also want to say that people should not thinking I am bashing Fanon at all. I am not! In any way. I am just saying that you are limitng your userbase to existing users. The main source of new users you get is usually people who have read the CPW and checked out the Fanon wiki. I just want you guys to start expanding this brilliant world out and making it more accessible for new users.

That's why I think it is essential that the main page gets an overhaul. It's the first thing people see. -- <font face="Tahoma">Tigernose    <font face="Aharoni">Talk  •  <font face="Aharoni">Contribs  19:28, 9 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Now you're thinking with portals, LOL. Honestly, that is an excellent idea. I would try to implement it, but I cannot edit the main page thanks to TurtleShroom, :( --XTUX345: "May the Bird of Paradise fly up your nose! May an elephant caress you with his toes!" 21:14, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Haha I was waiting for a Portal 2 reference :D Is TS even an admin anymore? Why does he get to protect pages? :S Zap just unprotected the main page I believe though. -- <font face="Tahoma">Tigernose  [[Image:Tigernose.png|link=User:Tigernose|20px]]  <font face="Aharoni">Talk  •  <font face="Aharoni">Contribs  21:33, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
 * TS was demoted to patroller a few months back, he only had his sysop/bureau rights removed. Back to the topic at hand, I fully agree. The main page has almost little to no content and focuses on social things rather than content. As for portals, I made the X-Virus Portal awhile back, although it seems like its been forgotten about. I'm all for a main page revamp, and I'm willing to make more portals as well. Zone 00:55, 10 May 2011 (UTC)